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Dofus 2.42 Changelog

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Anyone know when update will be on official servers?

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June 20th.

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That emerald nerf hurts my soul 

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As a solo accouter I disagree with most of the people complaining about the dungeon nerfs, it was content that was almost completely exclusive to multi-accouters, I for one have NEVER completed an end game dungeon without a multi-accouter and this isn't unique to me, the game designers saw this and didn't want it to be this way and nether do I. This update has been in the works for over a year. This isn't simply some reactive update in response to the communities complaints, they saw a trend that didn't fit there idea of how the content was ment to be experienced and they changed it. Its funny, when developers respond to the communities objections, people say the game is made by the players and when they don't people say there out of touch and don't care, I guess you really can't win for losing.

 

So what if mats and gear will get cheaper as a result of this? I don't expect the elitist multi-accouters to understand this fully, its like telling a fish that's its wet. They'll just have to deal with the changes. While y'all (elitist) are complaining about updates ruining your teams I'll be dancing in your tears with an umbrella and running cats eye dungeon with my pals so I don't have to pay someone with a team and arm and a leg for mats and gear.

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I was staying silent on this topic because it's just becoming a bit repetitive but oh well.

 

I think a lot of people have missed the fact that it wouldn't have been totally disastrous if they had slight nerfed some things, yes those of us who have well geared teams with basically every class at their disposal would rather have them the same difficulty because we can do the dungeons as they are at the moment, so why would we necessarily want a change given it provides a source of income. However, I know there are people who don't have time time/motivation to try to figure them out, or people who just don't get how the mechanics work (also a lot of people who never bother to really take the time to study them) and as a result give up. So a slight nerf to some things wouldn't have been totally bad in my opinion, or at least making the mechanics more easily understandable and visible in game.

 

What we have here is a total shambles. The dungeons are far too weak, end of. Just reading through the changelog I knew it would be the case, and lo and behold 1 day later we have videos of people soloing content using a bow and jump (big up volca). Yes not everyone will be able to but given that normally a dungeon solo took either a broken class or lots and lots of time (maybe think original titoboss f3 solos on sram except for mf ofc) it clearly shows that the dungeons have become too weak. I don't understand why anyone would want a dungeon that is so weak they might as well shut their brain off instead of one where they still have to engage enough with the content to pass it. Now I'm a student so I know that for over half the year I have no leg to stand on but during my holidays I work as a chef doing 17 hour shifts and often only getting a day off a week if that. So I get all the people saying they want to unwind, but for me unwinding by playing wasn't mindlessly spamming the same 3 buttons over and over as I kill a giant poutch but doing a few tries of something a little more complicated knowing that I had to put some thought into it. Yeah I'm lucky that I choose to follow the dungeons from their release and because I put the time in before can grasp the mechanics early, but anyone can do that. It's not hard, it just requires a bit of effort. This is an update to satisfy the bad and/or lazy to me. As a business decision I think it's kinda dumb from ankama, who's more likely to recommend a game? Person A who hates putting any effort in and spends most of the time complaining it's too hard. Or, Person B who, even though they might not be able to brush through the content like some others who this description applies to, gets to know their class, learns about the dungeon and the mobs and has a challenge that gives them a sense of pride when they win. 

 

My opinion is gonna piss some people off but we've had so much inane criticism of the same points that were brought up as soon as the update was revealed so I'm gonna ignore any direct responses unless they can lead to something constructive. But, to me this nerf is far far far far far too drastic, and I can't stress that enough. It didn't have to make these dungeons reach a point where they were excessively easy. There was a healthy balance of making mechanics more visible and some elements of the dungeon easier to counter, but this update is certainly not that.

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Posted (edited)

to people says that they r killing game:
they r not killing nothing,they always nerfed highest lvl dungs before to introduce a new row of top lvl dungs.... just be patient and wait(there are: this new area,,and still 10-11 dimensions missing!)

the worst thing is the nerf of agi osa...it seems they wanna make it reach the edge of unplayability of it, and i don't get why
many ppls complain that osa is OP when,for example, a class like sram is OP since 2004, and the top nerf ive seen on it is the "repelling trap:now it pushes and it makes even dmg" to avoid the count harebourg solo.stop.

Edited by --banipoalbe--

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"You know what? I'm glad." - Drupik, 2016

 

Endgame content has been getting more and more difficult with each update and for those who are trying to play the game while also maintaining a work/school life and who can't create a full team of the necessary classes - for whatever reasons, may that be ideologic, financial or technical - trying to tackle this content is exhausting and demotivating due to how much time and money needs to be put into succeeding. The current state of the endgame content has such an immense powercreep compared to the near-endgame content that a change is more than due.

 

Understandably, those who already have a full team and know these dungeons like their own hometown aren't going to be happy about anything that would make the endgame content too easy, as it provides them with an income with the still rare endgame resources and some, if not most of these specific players, actually enjoy the intense difficulty, even, or especially, when winning in an endgame dungeon might mean dying tenfold.

 

What the players with the full teams need to understand is that the game is in a niche market and after 13-14 years I know of very few people who would recommend Dofus to their friends, let alone new people actually sticking to it for more than a couple days to a week. Its complexity and time consuming nature is what scares a lot of new players and veterans mostly stick to the game because of the sunk-cost fallacy ("I can’t stop now, otherwise what I’ve invested so far will be lost.").

 

A common argument against the reduction in difficulty in endgame content is that it's meant to be a challenge and not everyone needs to have all achievements. That is, in a way, a valid argument, however it fails to see the consequences that result in such a mindset. The more inaccessibly (and exclusive to the very few with full teams and a seemingly abundance of time in their day-to-day lives) the endgame content is, the less people will be happy with the game. And the less people enjoy playing the game, the less they will want to keep playing the game, which then reduces the amount of people who are either willing or able to buy the endgame resources.

 

That all being said and put aside, and in the defence of difficult endgame content, it obviously shouldn't become as easy as running the Royal Gobball dungeon. It shouldn't even be as easy as Bworker or Celestial Bearbarian. And as glad as I am, that dungeons like Merkator will be easier with this update, the changes seem to make the endgame content way too easy to be given the term endgame content.

 

Instead what they should do is remove about half of the triggers that cause players to die over and over again because of a slight misstep or hitting the wrong target with the wrong spell and make the triggers that are still in place more visible and give the players a way to know what these triggers do (icons may be nice looking and don't consume as much screen real estate as a tooltip, however the triggers in Dofus aren't easy to be explained by an icon without a thesaurus at hand).

 

Summary: Shit's been difficult. Update makes shit too easy. Try the middle, Ankama. Players, try to understand the other side of the arguments. Not everyone likes dying, not everyone wants this game to turn into Candy Crush. Not everyone has a team, shit should be possible, albeit still difficult (in a sane way), for people without teams.

 

(Feel free to correct me where I might be wrong with the things I said. Feel free to tell me off, if you hate change. Might I recommend chess as a game then? I heard the game never even gets any updates anymore. Lazy developers.)

 

Also: See you guys in August. Goat's coming back.

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4 minutes ago, Goatee said:

"You know what? I'm glad." - Drupik, 2016

[snip]

...

[snap]

Also: See you guys in August. Goat's coming back.

you should go into politics, Goat :D 

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1 minute ago, winged-one said:

you should go into politics, Goat :D 

Alas politics are tainted with people being too dense to see further than 2 terms, working for lobbies more than for the people and I'm pretty sure I'd be killed fairly quickly. Well, maybe not in Germany. But here I'd have to listen to angry old men yelling about the dumbest shit.

 

I stick to walls of text on the internet for now. But thanks. :)

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Posted (edited)

54 minutes ago, Goatee said:

Instead what they should do is remove about half of the triggers that cause players to die over and over again because of a slight misstep or hitting the wrong target with the wrong spell and make the triggers that are still in place more visible and give the players a way to know what these triggers do (icons may be nice looking and don't consume as much screen real estate as a tooltip, however the triggers in Dofus aren't easy to be explained by an icon without a thesaurus at hand).

They did just that by in F3 by changing instakill effects into Pacifist state effects. About the triggers, I partially agree. Ankama has never given out how spells actually work, it has always been the players figuring it out (except some F2 dofustime vids like 2 years later). I do agree on certain spells like for instance Double push/pull effects in queen, captain scarlight push/pull effects, koutoulou madness triggers, some that really fuck with your mind. For 90% of the effects though, it takes like 3 seconds to figure out. Take F3 for instance, stalak reflect, skateman armageddon, harrogant reflect/heals, snowdew pushback etc. etc. 

You literally SEE what is happening when you hit something, so you click on the mob in the timeline, see what trigger it has active, and know next time not to hit it like that when it has it's trigger spell. 

 

Besides, adding too much text/icons/descriptions to the fight will only help for the people who're new to the dungeon for the first few runs. I personally like the invuln icon (if it's even displayed correctly), but more than that will just be confusing. (imagine Vortex with more icons above mobs, you won't be able to see anything anymore). There are countless topics on the forums (Imps, JoL, OF, 3rd party sites) about spells, effects, strategies and so on. When I started Count for instance, I would just have a cheatsheet next to my dofus client with rotations until I got used to them. For sylargh I had a txt file open with font size over 9000 saying <90% HP, for nileza I had all the ranges where you would die on which turns open. (Klime was a joke with masquerade, didn't really need anything there). I feel like I'm going back to where I started so I'll just stop ranting.

 

Last thing, I'd love to see some statistics about percentages of players who beat the end-game content like they released about F2 at some point. @Izmar it would be awesome if you can get some statistics on these, to finally see how bad it really is.

 

Edit: also nice that you're coming back ^____^

 

Edit 2: Banipoalbe, if you're serious about the new dungeon being epic and challenging content after these nerfs, do check out some of the information and videos about it. If a level 102 sram can solo it, it's definitely not challenging at all for a level 200 team. But yes, I do hope there will be new dungeons implemented after these nerfs that are at least interesting and preferably difficult to beat.

Edited by bobeur
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30 minutes ago, bobeur said:

For 90% of the effects though, it takes like 3 seconds to figure out. Take F3 for instance, stalak reflect, skateman armageddon, harrogant reflect/heals, snowdew pushback etc. etc. 

You literally SEE what is happening when you hit something, so you click on the mob in the timeline, see what trigger it has active, and know next time not to hit it like that when it has it's trigger spell.

The problem is that even then things like that can catch you by surprise, so it would be nice to have some sort of notice that when you're targeting something with a spell that's going to mess everything up maybe a warning icon could appear, at the very least telling you that if you continue, something is going to happen and you might not want it to.

 

30 minutes ago, bobeur said:

Last thing, I'd love to see some statistics about percentages of players who beat the end-game content like they released about F2 at some point.

I would love more stats period. How many White Gobblys did I kill? how many hours did I actually play? How many recall potions have I used. How much kamas would I have if I never spent any of them? How many times did I die in total, in the first Dungeon room, vs monster/monster family X, pvp, how many times did I win?

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to boebeur:
i didn't say that i like it
i got more than 16k achieve points)missing like 300 achieve points in events) and i did all without changing class anytime all with my old and new osa...so i like the hard things in game
but i guess(hope)amanka people are not idiots and they know if there will not be a nightmare challenge for the players like hard dung achieves,several will quit...
all has sense in my opinion...this lvl 200dungs nerf,it's a step for the lvl 201 class,equips and new dungs
lets wait and we will see

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I hope you're right, that would be nice. 

 

3 hours ago, Goatee said:

I would love more stats period. How many White Gobblys did I kill? how many hours did I actually play? How many recall potions have I used. How much kamas would I have if I never spent any of them? How many times did I die in total, in the first Dungeon room, vs monster/monster family X, pvp, how many times did I win?

 

I'm afraid those statistics would make me want to delete my life :-D

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6 minutes ago, bobeur said:

I'm afraid those statistics would make me want to delete my life :-D

That's always the response I get. I'll gladly sacrifice your life for these stats.

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I'm excited for these changes - personally I think the dungeon nerfs are welcome. Dungeons that seemed undoable to me now finally seem possible.

 

But honestly, these are gonna roll out like any Ankama update. They implement it, get massive player complaints, tweak it in whatever way is fastest so the whining is a little less, and then as time goes on people get used to it and start to see the positives. People have been threatening to quit this game over "update 2.x" since there was a 2.x and they're still around. These changes will get put in the game, parts will suck, and then Ankama will fix about 25%-35% of the sucky parts.

 

Life goes on. 

 

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Posted (edited)

Yeah, I agree with @Goatee , so many casual players don't even attempt end game content because pardon my french, the shits difficult, and requires too much time, resources, and general commitment for a team of randoms or even friends to tackle. Well see how these changes play out I suppose, I wouldn't want them to make end game content TOO easy but coming from a solo-accounter whose never completed ANY end game content for the reasons I've mentioned, any change, even if its an extreme one, I'll take it if it means I can actually play the content and I really do want a chance at playing and winning in these dungeons. I'll finally feel like being 200 means something other than grinding for kamas to buy gear so I can play a little better in pvp cause it sure as heck didn't open up this vast world of running end game dungeons.

Edited by anthonyclark
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Posted (edited)

I can read "single-accounter" and "multi-accounter" quite often here in this thread.

It would be interesing to know how this works together in relation with difficulty...

 

No clue if this totally offtopc but i hardly see a 8 man single-account team finish any endgame content...

So the whole game is build unter the assumption of people logging more than one a time ^^

(not talking about the struggle of getting members for a group)

Should be possible with 4 man, using Teamspeak... i suppose...

 

If its possible to restrict PVP to just one account it should be possible to restrict regular fights as well... and let this have own achievements ;)

Edited by winged-one

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1 minute ago, winged-one said:

I can read "single-accounter" and "multi-accounter" quite often here in this thread.

It would be interesing to know how this works together in relation with difficulty...

 

No clue if this totally offtopc but i hardly see a 8 man single-account team finish any endgame content...

So the whole game is build unter the assumption of people logging more than one a time ^^

(not talking about the struggle of getting members for a group)

Should be possible with 4 man, using Teamspeak... i suppose...

 

If its possible to restrict PVP to just one account it should be possible to restrict regular fights as well... and let this have own achievements ;)

No more restrictions like that, people already bypass the 1 acc per perc/prism by multilogging

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Although I haven't played in a few months, I've been lurking this thread for a quite a while.

Viewed from a solo-account perspective or people who haven't completed the majority of the endgame content this nerf is more than welcome. First off the content becomes way more accessible to a broader selection of players and secondly you don't need a very specific team to beat it. A random composition with no planned strategy should be able to beat any endgame dungeon after the nerf.

 

As for the multi-accounters who have beaten everything this update is "wow gtfo, keep it as it is". Which I perfectly understandable since prices will plummet and gear will become more available. Most of the multi-accounters still have one main char where they want to get max achievements on right ? (myself included) I'm not speaking for every multi-accounter here but the difficulty and optimization that was needed to complete these endgame achievements is what kept me going. I don't mind spending a month straight trying to do some duo or run 5 other dungeons to craft this set that's needed for a specific achiev. It's what's kept me hooked to the game for all these years.

 

I understand that it's still an MMO and people shouldn't be running 8 accounts and "easily" beating todays new content. But Amakna has no restrictions regarding multi-accounting so why wouldn't you do it? These last years the population on the INT servers were on the bridge of extinction, GG trying to find a specific combo to beat X endgame dungeon.

 

Although I don't agree with this solution since I still run a full team, the content will become more accessible, especially for solo-accounters which is definitely a step in the right direction to a real MMO.

 

Alright to the bread and butter of this post. A perfect solution for this problem? is introducing stages of difficulties for each dungeon similar to the WoW raiding system (normal, heroic and mythic). For each difficulty mobs have more health, hit harder and have additional effects. These harder difficulties introduce more mats generated every time you beat it (1x boss resource, 5x boss resources, 10x boss resources). This way people can still beat the endgame dungeons on normal to craft stuff, complete quests or just do them for plain fun. In addition to that the people that do want a challenge or claim that top spot on the achievement ladder still have something to look forward to.

 

Anyways pretty much my two cents on all this.

 

PS: tumblr_mzp4uw8vKO1qcga5ro1_500.gif

 

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So, heres the thing, I've never played World of Warcraft and I hear it being mentioned pretty frequently. I've seen a couple videos here and there so I know at least one thing. It aint no Dofus and I don't think what works for WoW can be applied here because of a couple things.

 

1) We don't really know where Ankama stands on the subject of multi-accounters and this also dictates, at a length, my feelings about the whole thing cause I want to trust the judgement of the developers on this matter, if they say it's not a problem or that they want to see how this feature of the game develops, then I'm go with that, they have far more data and resources at their disposal and seeing as how they've never come out and directly asked for the communities input about it, I'm gunna assume they know all they need and this directly affects the implementation of a feature like this the way I see it because...

 

2) It send the message, whether intentional or otherwise, that if you REALLY want to compete without completing said dungeon 50x times or whatever you essentially have to run the dungeon as a multi-accounter in order to do to. Heres how I see it, either Dofus is an MMO that stresses individual players cooperating/competing on some kind of a level playing field or it isn't. This just creates a group of elites who compete on the same playing field than more casual Dofus players but essentially have this leg-up on the competition simply because they didn't have the time/resources to run multiple accounts.

 

Both these points in some way dictate the future of the game, if multi-logging is gunna be an integral feature of the game they should either make it easier to do or impose certain limitations in order to make it more fair to casual gamers who this game is most likely built around.

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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Veldin said:

Alright to the bread and butter of this post. A perfect solution for this problem? is introducing stages of difficulties for each dungeon similar to the WoW raiding system (normal, heroic and mythic). For each difficulty mobs have more health, hit harder and have additional effects. These harder difficulties introduce more mats generated every time you beat it (1x boss resource, 5x boss resources, 10x boss resources). This way people can still beat the endgame dungeons on normal to craft stuff, complete quests or just do them for plain fun. In addition to that the people that do want a challenge or claim that top spot on the achievement ladder still have something to look forward to.

 

lNUh0uV.gif

 

Yes, we really need this. 2.42 would get a completely different reaction if they added these nerfed version of the affected dungeons as some sort of "easy" mode, keep the difficulty from 2.41 as "normal/difficult" mode and add a new difficulty as "epic" mode. And it's been requested so many times in the past already.

Edited by Goatee
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Posted (edited)

.

Edited by ikaruspl
i don't wanna share this post anymore
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Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, ikaruspl said:

we got idols. so what's a point to add something like that? I dont see the point 

 

Well, if you take idols for this then there should be reversed idols with -loot -xp that are making fights easier.

problem solved without much struggle :D 


(haven't they stated already that they are not going to do this?)

 

EDIT: Also, keep in mind: Things would become easier if they had implemented their idea of level 200+ (better spells) already ;)

Edited by winged-one

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3 hours ago, Veldin said:

Alright to the bread and butter of this post. A perfect solution for this problem? is introducing stages of difficulties for each dungeon similar to the WoW raiding system (normal, heroic and mythic). For each difficulty mobs have more health, hit harder and have additional effects. These harder difficulties introduce more mats generated every time you beat it (1x boss resource, 5x boss resources, 10x boss resources). This way people can still beat the endgame dungeons on normal to craft stuff, complete quests or just do them for plain fun. In addition to that the people that do want a challenge or claim that top spot on the achievement ladder still have something to look forward to.

 

 

Indeed, just that they take idols as a dumb excuse for w/e reason to not introduce that.

 

In no way are idols a replacement for the difficulty. It's constraints like MP or damage typically which is the same thing for each dungeon. On top, they are not even balanced for high scores (Cra/Enu top, close range trash). The crucial thing is that the mechanics get partially destroyed if the update takes place as planned. No mechanics = dungeons get increasingly identical (by the way exactly what I wanted to demonstrate mainly with the video: nothing particular to take care of, the fights resemble almost standard rooms).

 

Also, idols don't provide any benefit for endgame dungeons except the drop which is obsolete with the achievement reward system. It's extremely rare that they are indeed used with the intention to have more challenge, which is logical since the practical interest behind it doesn't exist - Completely different story with difficulty levels which provide a different intensity of rewards, etc.

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